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Discussion Starter #41
What about KYB struts? Adjustable are about 60% of the cost of Koni, non adjustable are about 30% of the cost. Going with KYB AGX it's a hundred a corner, vs about 165 each (Prime MR2 prices), that's 260 dollars less for an adjustable strut insert. That covers springs (if I didnt want to go with the 93 I have sitting on a shelf), or all the prothane bushing etc.

With non adjustable it's about 200 for the SET, vs 165/corner. Thats 460ish less - prothane bushings, springs, and start getting strut tops etc

Im not racing, just spirited driving here and there (this is a 'weekend' car for me, a second car).

With so much on my plate/to do list, Im looking at ways to trim down the cost a little. Im a state gov worker, while I make a solid salary (own my home in the suburbs, can afford a project car, have many motorcycles, vacation each year etc etc), I dont have THAT much to dump into a car. So Im looking at other options and looking for advice on these possible routes.
 

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No one said this would be inexpensive to do, you're performing major suspension surgery. You need a certain budget to do this. IMO, if you're not prepared, you should save up.

I've owned a set of the AGX and I wouldn't mount them again even if a magical elf gifted them to me brand new for free. KYB don't put 10s of millions into R&D and test their products for daily drivers by winning international races over & over - and it shows in their product. When I switched over to a real shock without changing anything else, the experience was eye-opening, I was actually pissed at the comparison. There's a price difference for a reason, and a one time cost of an extra $260 is nominal.

On the other hand, if you don't really think you'll notice the difference between shocks (or if you do and don't mind compromising some on suspension compliance), then there's nothing stopping you from going ahead with your plan.
 

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Having just done a full suspension rebuild myself, I can tell you that a lot of your questions can be answered by using the search function. If you want something not so great by real world standards, sure you can save a few dollars by going KYB. However, Bilstein and KONI are your only real options outside of $2300+ coilovers.

No one said this would be inexpensive to do, you're performing major suspension surgery. You need a certain budget to do this. IMO, if you're not prepared, you should save up.
This is on the nose! You will likely only be doing this once as the refresh will easily last 10-15+ years. Do you really want to skimp on a few dollars to (maybe) later regret not doing it "right" the first time? I would also suggest saving up and doing it right once.
 

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The spring pre-load adjuster / bottom spring perch is locked in via an allen bolt. It will not move once locked in place.
Yep I'm dumb. Those must have been loose and I didn't notice during the initial adjustments. When properly tight the height can be adjusted without harming the preload or disconnecting the knuckle.
 

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No one said this would be inexpensive to do, you're performing major suspension surgery. You need a certain budget to do this. IMO, if you're not prepared, you should save up.

I've owned a set of the AGX and I wouldn't mount them again even if a magical elf gifted them to me brand new for free. KYB don't put 10s of millions into R&D and test their products for daily drivers by winning international races over & over - and it shows in their product. When I switched over to a real shock without changing anything else, the experience was eye-opening, I was actually pissed at the comparison. There's a price difference for a reason, and a one time cost of an extra $260 is nominal.

On the other hand, if you don't really think you'll notice the difference between shocks (or if you do and don't mind compromising some on suspension compliance), then there's nothing stopping you from going ahead with your plan.
I agree with this. Before going to Koni Sport dampers, I cheaped out and got some Tokico Illumina 5-way adjustables. They're better than the AGX by a long shot but still miles behind Bilstein and Koni. The KYB AGX, Tokico Illumina, Bilstein B6, Koni Sport are all twin-tube dampers so it all boils down to how they're valved.
 

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I have koni's in my mr2. They are much more comfortable than the stock shocks they replaced. They feel much better on the street. I don't track.

I have had kyb agx in my old gt4 celica (alltrac), these were mr2 agx that I custom fit (the celica strut housings are sealed and they didn't make a model for that car). They were hard as hell and that was a much heavier car. It handled fine but wasn't very forgiving, I would hate to think how they would be in a much lighter mr2.

The rear upper strut mounts are very expensive but are well worth it. The rubber is likely brittle and hard now in original ones. Definitely worth doing along with the front ones. My front ones hardly turned the bearings were so shot. If I were doing everything in more than one go I would do the poly bushes, end links, lower ball joints, tie rods. Then go back and do the springs, shocks and strut mounts later.
 

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I've personally never went with coilovers in any of my cars. I've never tracked them either. Everything I have read or heard leads me to believe I will lose more ride quality than I am willing to compromise on something I intend to drive every day the weather allows. I have been running koni yellows and ~1" drop springs on my mk1 and mk2, cannot say enough good things. I do wish they were just 4-5 way notched adjustable cuz there are times I would like to easily change them on the fly without having to count turns(or judge partial turns) but thats my only complaint. Had an issue with one and had a replacement within a few days through their lifetime warranty (not sure they offer it anymore as it has been a few years since I bought a set)
Putting love into my '91 and will be grabbing a geometry correction kit from Wilhelm shortly. Got hooked up with a full set of poly bushings and plan on grabbing some strut mounts as well.
Unless you need the adjustable right height and spring tension.... I just cannot see justifying coilovers in a daily.
 

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I've personally never went with coilovers in any of my cars. I've never tracked them either. Everything I have read or heard leads me to believe I will lose more ride quality than I am willing to compromise on something I intend to drive every day the weather allows. I have been running koni yellows and ~1" drop springs on my mk1 and mk2, cannot say enough good things. I do wish they were just 4-5 way notched adjustable cuz there are times I would like to easily change them on the fly without having to count turns(or judge partial turns) but thats my only complaint. Had an issue with one and had a replacement within a few days through their lifetime warranty (not sure they offer it anymore as it has been a few years since I bought a set)
Putting love into my '91 and will be grabbing a geometry correction kit from Wilhelm shortly. Got hooked up with a full set of poly bushings and plan on grabbing some strut mounts as well.
Unless you need the adjustable right height and spring tension.... I just cannot see justifying coilovers in a daily.


As a guy with a used to be very sensitive stomach (feel nauseous often). I've tried all sorts of suspension, over 10-15 different variants including koni(good), billsteins, TRD, OEM 93(ok), AGX (crap), KYB (crap), KSports, megans, BC with various spring rates.

Fortunes for the win, they're just that good. They're comfy

Comfort, Performance, Adjustability. Only downside is they may not get you to hellaflush low if that is still popular now a days lol
 

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Keep in mind one thing: Fortune coilovers (like most coilovers) aren't warrantied when street driving; track only. Additionally, the most important part - the shocks - are only under warranty for 12 months.

Unlike most coilover companies, Koni doesn't have a rebuild service because they don't need it - they just last. But if by some astronomical chance that all 4 of your Koni shocks blow simultaneously at anytime during their life on the same car (like maybe 20 years down the road in 2040), just send them back to get 4 new free replacements (they will not send you rebuilt dampers).

I'm on my 11th year of a daily SW20, still on the same comfy adjustable shocks I bought in 2009.
 

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Discussion Starter #50
with bumpstops - I understand that on lowered cars (like getting the eibach pro springs), that they have to be cut, correct?
And is that at all four corners?
 

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Yes, cut the bump stops all around.
For camber, you may or may not need it. In my case, I didn't need it and was able to adjust up to 1.5 degrees.
 

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with bumpstops - I understand that on lowered cars (like getting the eibach pro springs), that they have to be cut, correct?
And is that at all four corners?
Eibach Prokit isn't very low. You'd not need to cut the bump stops for those particular springs. My TRD springs run higher than most, no idea why and are very comfortable as they don't hit the bump stops much with normal road conditions. Except for the dampers not being quite suited to the spring, little more bounce than I want, they are nice.
 

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I have RSR springs on my car paired with Koni Sports (Yellows) with an advertised drop of 0.8" front and 1.0" rear. I forgot to trim the bump stops upon initial install and bottomed out everywhere. After trimming them, it was a night and day difference and so much nicer to drive. 🤷‍♂️
 

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I have RSR springs on my car paired with Koni Sports (Yellows) with an advertised drop of 0.8" front and 1.0" rear. I forgot to trim the bump stops upon initial install and bottomed out everywhere. After trimming them, it was a night and day difference and so much nicer to drive. 🤷‍♂️
I had some RS-R springs and they were very low at the front. Thinking about it, maybe trimming the bump stops is a good idea for the lowered MR2 as it would be less 'crashy' over bigger bumps.
I'll take your advice and give it a go. (y)
 

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I had some RS-R springs and they were very low at the front. Thinking about it, maybe trimming the bump stops is a good idea for the lowered MR2 as it would be less 'crashy' over bigger bumps.
I'll take your advice and give it a go. (y)
The RS-Rs and TRDs are rated for about the same amount of drop. It makes me wonder if they used different model years to do their development on. Maybe TRD used the early model (up to '92 for the U.S.) Rev. 1 and RS-R used the later model rev. 2 (U.S. 93+). On factory sized 15" tires, my car had about a 1/2" (~12mm) tire to fender gap all around.
 

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The RS-Rs and TRDs are rated for about the same amount of drop. It makes me wonder if they used different model years to do their development on. Maybe TRD used the early model (up to '92 for the U.S.) Rev. 1 and RS-R used the later model rev. 2 (U.S. 93+). On factory sized 15" tires, my car had about a 1/2" (~12mm) tire to fender gap all around.
My TRD are high vs other owners so not sure what is going on there. I have the last set of TRD soft springs sold in NZ. Soft spring sets vs hard spring sets were only a stiffer rear spring. Front stayed the same rate. I'm using Bilstien Blacks from a 99 JDM GT. Not that dampers change ride height. The suspension spring perches and top hats locations didn't change during the years. (Yes they did change but not the bit that locates the spring) Only springs and damper rates. Toyota 'cut' the REV3-5 springs to lower the car vs the REV1 and 2. So spring coil length (rod of steel used to create the spring) is shorter than the earlier versions. I work with JDM parts as that is what NZ got. I haven't cross referenced USDM and JDM spring part numbers but I'm sure some match.
Here is my comparison on my car.
 
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