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2GRE-FE swap

35K views 136 replies 18 participants last post by  92NAMR2 
#1 · (Edited)
2GR-FE swap

I have been reading up about the 2GR-FE swap and just bought my car recently. Right now I am trying to get a hold on everything I need up front from all of the extremely helpful posts people have made so far.

So far I have a 92 N/A. And am waiting about 6 weeks for my engine lift to arrive so I can install it and start work. In the meantime I want to use this time to start gathering parts and prepping for it. I am considering buying a crashed donor car so I don't have to keep running to the junk yard, so that brings me to my first question.

After I get this running and reliable I will plan to add a turbo later. Is anyone running a turbo here with stock ECU or is a stand alone needed?

1) If I purchase a donor car is there one that is recommended as the best? It seems the wiring harness form the Rav4 works best?

2) Is there any issue having the donor car be an automatic?

3) Is it possible to keep the power steering or will I have to delete this?

4) I'll be using a E153 Transmission. I noticed I need a V6 Flywheel, can this come from the donor car I buy or does it need to be specific? I saw someone used a Camry 1MZ for one.

I have started a list of items below, any info you can add would be awesome of things that you would do different or recommend.

2GR-FE Motor Verify imobilizer situation, seems there is a delete kit.
Change plugs/Belts hoses/Water pump
Check VVT oil line If rubber, replace with metal
4th motor mount
Alternator
Starter
Tachometer from 1mz
DBW pedal W/ Adapter
Need original Harness and donor harness.
Harness conversion
ECU Can take off immobilizer
Exhaust (possibly adding turbo next year)
Y pipe
A/C (including?) MK3 compressor? Might leave this off at first and add later
Intake
MAF
Water neck converter
E153 Transmission
Turbo Trans mounts
Turbo LSD Axles
Turbo Clutch pedal Option
Turbo Shifter Cables
Turbo Hubs
Turbo Brakes Option (are there bigger brakes easily available?)
Turbo Brake Master Cylinder Option (look at other brakes)
Turbo Brake Booster Option (look at other brakes)
255 lph fuel pump Supra TT pump
Alloy Flywheel Need a V6 Flywheel. Camry?
Clutch Southbend Stg 2 Endurance (495 ft lbs) as an option
Clutch slave and hose
17/18 staggered wheels Not required
BC coil overs Not required
Fuel system FPR and return line Aeromotive A1000-6? $300
Passenger Axle Carrier Use 2gr two piece or the 3sgte piece and slot the holes
O2 sensors in y pipe before headers merge?
 
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#2 ·
0) Gouky's S/C tuned stock ECU might work for a low boost turbo setup - ask him.
1) Probably any 2GR car is OK if you're willing to source the RAV4 harness separately to get the cleanest ECU install.
2) They all are.
3) MR2's power steering is completely independent of the engine. You will remove the PS pump from the donor 2GR, if it has one (some 2GR cars have electrically assisted PS and do not have a PS pump on the engine).
4) Donor car will have an AT flexplate (not a flywheel). Must get a 1mz, 2vz or 3vz flywheel. But NOT a truck v6 flywheel.
 
#3 ·
I am considering buying a crashed donor car so I don't have to keep running to the junk yard, so that brings me to my first question.
Buying a crashed donor can work, that used to matter more when we needed to keep the immobilizer bits to get a proper car built but now that i sell a modded ECU without immobilizer the need isn't nearly as important anymore.

After I get this running and reliable I will plan to add a turbo later. Is anyone running a turbo here with stock ECU or is a stand alone needed?
it depends what your horsepower goals are. I've got a tune that will work at 10psi on the stock ECU right now but at the moment there's no way to tune it yourself. if you want to go standalone you sacrifice some of the fantastic stock ECU drivability and engine protection but i'd be happy to help you with some starter maps if you want to go that way.

1) If I purchase a donor car is there one that is recommended as the best? It seems the wiring harness form the Rav4 works best?
The rav4 wiring harness is much easier to deal with but otherwise there really isn't a preference as to which donor you use.

2) Is there any issue having the donor car be an automatic?
There are no factory manual applications for the 2GR-FE.

3) Is it possible to keep the power steering or will I have to delete this?
The MR2 uses electric power steering. you will delete the pump from the motor but the MR2 will retain its power steering.

4) I'll be using a E153 Transmission. I noticed I need a V6 Flywheel, can this come from the donor car I buy or does it need to be specific? I saw someone used a Camry 1MZ for one.
you can use the factory 1mz/3vz flywheel or the lightweight fidanza unit that is available for those applications (PN: 130881)
 
#9 ·
Thanks for all the replies so far, and answers. I am really excited to get started.

As merryFrankster noted I have read what feels like hundreds of posts to collect my list so I may very well have found yours too!! Thanks.

It will take me about 6-8 weeks before I can really start work but I plan to pre purchase a lot of stuff. My time working on the car is limited to about 1 day every 2 weeks so I want to be as efficient as possible. Gouky, I'll be reaching out to you once I get further along about using some of your stuff.

Once I have some updates I'll keep posting and I'll try to put up photos as I go. In the end I may try to paint the car myself as well (so it may look fantastic or really awful...)
 
#10 · (Edited)
#11 ·
That flare job is a little more complex than I am looking to do, but do you have an after painting photo? Great job so far.


I am starting to look at sourcing parts. The below parts are the first on the list if anyone has any please send me a PM. I have seen a lot of mis priced stuff online or just mislabeled so I am taking my time looking for them.

For the engine I think I'll be looking for a crashed RAV4 so I can get gas pedal/harness/ecu as well.

E153 Transmission (w/LSD)
Turbo Trans mounts
Turbo LSD Axles
Turbo Clutch pedal Option
Turbo Shifter Cables
Turbo Hubs

PM me if you have any of those parts.
 
#13 · (Edited)
I got these parts mostly from facebook and eBay. There are some active sellers on the "Mr2 parts for sale or wanted" group. Note there are two versions of the group one international and one US. Post a "WTB" there and you should get responses quickly. Use paypal and pay the product sales fee it's worth it in case there is a dispute or delay. On eBay there are some JDM importers whom I also had good luck with.

The mounts are becoming scarce. For the front mount on the firewall there is a third party mount available cheap.It is not the greatest quality but you can re-inforce it with resin if you desire. I think mine may have already broke already even with the reinforcement. The front bracket that goes with this IIRC is same as NA. For the top transmission mount you will also need the bracket/plate that mounts it to the trans housing. I had to source these two items separately. The rear bracket is difficult to find, and so is the mount. I scoured the internet or days and days before I scored these separately. Maybe you can find a transmission that comes with the brackets attached.

PS. https://www.facebook.com/groups/263132943839394/?fref=nf
 
#15 ·
So I am trying to narrow down what 2GR to buy. I found a transmission I am considering buying and just getting some photos and background on it now.

Any advice on what year motors to look for. I read one of Gouky's old posts saying that the Highlander motor w/ the oil cooler is a good start. Any other advice? Is there certain years that work best?

I have been looking at the motors seem to go for 2-3.5k which I felt seemed high for a motor where there are so many available, is this just the going rate? Or should I look harder.

Also any advice on a clutch for daily driver / weekend track. I either will put a turbo on right away or within a year and run ~10psi so 400-450ft lbs.

-Mike
 
#17 ·
I have been looking at the motors seem to go for 2-3.5k which I felt seemed high for a motor where there are so many available, is this just the going rate? Or should I look harder.

Also any advice on a clutch for daily driver / weekend track. I either will put a turbo on right away or within a year and run ~10psi so 400-450ft lbs.
When I was looking there were lots of options in the 1500-2000 range. I ended up paying $2000 for a 2012 motor with 30k miles, with a few extras included.

Not sure what to do with that torque level, but I really like my Southbend clutch. I was using it on my ~375whp 3S before sending it back to get refreshed for use on the 2GR. But that was under 350ft-lb peak.
 
#16 ·
If you are going to build the motor or tear it down and refresh it I would go with a cheap one. If you dont want to touch anything before you drop it in I would go with a 2010+ where they have fixed the leaking timing cover, bad coils and vvti line already. Also beware the early oil cooler lines are prone to rupture at higher mileage.
 
#18 ·
Update:
I have ordered a bunch of parts including an E153 Trans.

I also think I found out why the motors seem to be more expensive. In searching it looks like the highlander motor w/o oil cooler is 1200-2000 and with an oil cooler is 2200-3500. Almost 1000 extra. My question is, are there any differences besides having an oil cooler? If not i'll buy a cheaper one and just install an oil cooler.

My end goal is still to run 8-10 psi boost with the stock ECU with a turbo rather than a S/C.

In terms of the Trans, I have not ever rebuilt one before but did some searching and it appears to be a straight forward job. Any pointers from anyone?

I am waiting on the trans to arrive before I can figure out if it has multi piece syncros or 1 piece so I can order parts.
 
#19 ·
Right then so I got an engine from a Camry for $1,200 plus shipping and it turned out pretty good but obviously no oil cooler. So then Marc mentioned that you can get a skirt (in other words oil pan) fitted for a cooler for about $200. Looks like an arbitrage or value add opportunity there, buy up engines, fit them with oil pans, and sell them, making a cool $800 or so on each for your trouble.

What kind of turbo were you thinking of? Twin turbo? Or single turbo? As best I can tell from looking at a few threads, the most straightforward solution that appeals to me is to put a single turbo in the trunk (fed through the bottom of the trunk) with an intercooler more or less in the stock 3sgte location (fed through the rear firewall. I saw some pics of one guy did that with a 1mz I believe.... are you thinking along those lines? Or something different?
 
#20 ·
My plan is a single small turbo so it spools quickly. I'll run 7-8 psi to start and if Gouky can get a map to run higher then i'll jump up to 10psi ish. I was going to wait until I have the motor in to plan where to put it to be honest. I was hoping to fit it inside the current engine bay and keep the trunk in tack. If it does fit then i'll cut out the trunk fire wall and throw it back there. I think the bigger issue is where to put the intercooler. I'll likely run a small one.

I also am going to try and run a Transmission cooler and oil cooler, so I have a bunch of stuff I need to put somewhere. I am trying to look at getting a different hood with a vent and put the trans and oil coolers up by the radiator so it doesn't take up space and add heat to the engine bay. If that doesn't work I'll take the passenger side vent and put one of the coolers there. The intake is likely going to stick into the drivers side vent.

I'll most likely buy Gouky's headers and motor mount and he is going to work with me on the ECU.

First I'll be rebuilding the Trans then purchasing the Motor and then making the final decision on turbo or no turbo. All this should go down in the next 4 weeks.

I'll likely not be going with the oil cooled highlander motor, and start looking at the other options to find one under 1500.
 
#21 ·
I only say this as you are pulling the trans apart any way. Have you thought about changing the final drive? With boost, first gear may become useless. I got a Camry V6 trans with the 3.6 for $400 shipped. I thought about using 1,2,5 MR2 and 3 & 4 of the Camry with the 3.6 but just swapped the r&p and oil pump.
 
#22 ·
If you plan on running an external oil cooler, there is very little reason to get the oil cooler motor. Just buy the upper pan from an oil cooler motor so you have the oil ports.
 
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#23 ·
I did some quick searching, is that the ST165 trans? with a 3.93 F/D ratio as opposed to the 4.23 F/D ratio in the E153?

I like the idea of having taller gears, not only to get more use out of first but just to make the highway drive nicer as well. I haven't chosen what size tire I am going with but likely a 245/45/17 rear tire (this is a 25" diameter). Right now I have 195's on 16's (which I think is a 24"). With this larger diameter it will also lower the RPM ~8% if I did my math correctly. I read someone had a E153 that had 3600 RPM @80mph which seems really high considering my drive to work is at 80 most of the way. My WRX is about 3100 @80 which is tolerable albeit a bit droney.

Swapping to a 3.93 should lower that by about 300rpm at 80 and also get second to reach over 60 mph. Again this is using other peoples data and I am not sure what tires they were running when taking this data.

I stole the below from another thread username KBlake:

The ST165 also has the 3.93 setup, and requires 3 parts to be swapped. New cost on all 3 was ~$450.

The Toyota part numbers are:

3.933 Shaft, Output 33321-20120
3.933 Gear, Ring 41221-12240
3.933 Gear, Oil Pump 33407-12011



I do plan on rebuilding my E153 once it arrives and I can determine what synchro setup it has it and get some parts. Do you have some advice on whether the above is really the only parts to be swapped. They had mentioned bearings needed to be a different width. I have never rebuilt a trans before so I want to be very sure of everything before I crack the seal. If it is just substituting those three parts then I think I will do it. If there is other issues with swapping these I can always look at getting 26" diameter tires (like a 245/45/18) which takes the reduction to 17% from my current tire although then I'll be spending extra on tires every swap.

Anyone have any further notes about clutches? I was surprised there wasn't more information on clutches for holding 450 ft lbs or higher for the E153 bolted to a 1MZ flywheel.
 
#24 ·
UPDATE:

I have my E153 and started cracking it open. So far the 5th gear case is off and the 5th gear and 5th driven gear. I am about to crack the rest of the case and need to go get a T45 socket tonight to finish. My plan is to replace the syncrhos and check other parts. I noticed there is a oil line running out and right back into the trans, is this something I can just send to a Transmission cooler?

I read a lot about the pedals, and how there are about 3-4 different shaped drive by wire pedals. Did anyone take photos of theirs installed? Have people tracked their cars and tested out some heel toe action? The thing that always annoyed me about my WRX is that there is no easy way to brake that lets me tap the gas.

Next question:

I found a Avalon 2014 motor with super low miles for 2600 with accessories and wiring harness. How much of a pain is it to use the Avalon wiring harness vs the recommended Rav4? (I PM'd Dave Mush this same question as I am reaching out to him to see about splicing the harness's together)

I am hoping to purchase the 2GR within 2 weeks, and have the trans done shortly after that. About 3 weeks from now I will be pulling the motor out of the MR2 and the real work will begin.


I already have the following parts on hand waiting
Turbo Hubs
93+ Turbo Brakes
E153
Shifter cables
Master and Slave cylinders
Axles inner and outer

I was looking at using this clutch. Southbend Stage 2 Endurance.
My question is how to I verify it will fit. Do I look up for a E153 fitting or for a 1MZ fitting (as I assume that is the flywheel I will get).

Thanks in advance for the help.
 
#25 ·
1. Correct this is oil cooler line. While you have the trans out replace the output shaft seals, just a few bucks per side, and be ridiculously careful with the driver side seal if you just look at it sideways it will end up leaking.

2. I have avalon pedal with Gouky's pedal adapter. The position is good for heel toe the thing is the sensitivity of these pedals is annoying they give zero feel or resistance/feedback. Marc is working on a new style pedal for his 2ar/Spyder swap maybe this is something we'll see in the MKII eventually.

3. Avalon/Camry harness you just take a hole-saw to the passenger side, get hold of a big fat grommet from somewhere (trip to the salvage yard) and mount the ECU in the trunk on the passenger side. The reach of the harness into the trunk is perfect. Not a big deal.

4. Hubs: Get new bearings. These are pricey but for hubs that you don't know where they came from it's probably justified. Shift Cables: Consider solid bushings made in china solid bushings are a few dollars for a boxful. Slave cylinder: Consider the single feed slave mod. Couldn't be happier with this. Axles: Inspect the boots carefully for any rips or cuts. Heck just replace the boots with new (OEM boot kit is about $50 per axle), clean the races, and repack with new grease, wish I'd done this BEFORE mounting the axles on the car ended up having to do it after.

K go have fun.
 
#31 ·
Interesting. I wonder if I ended up with a pre-recall pedal (off of eBay), as it seems to have a decent amount of friction in it. Feels like a fairly normal gas pedal. But I haven't taken it apart, and until now didn't know there was a difference.
 
#32 ·
don't quote the numbers but essentially the pedals had room for about 3mm of wear to the friction surfaces and the recall required the clearance to be measured and a shim put in to lock out all but 0.2mm of wear. so even if that is on your pedal you may still be on that 0.2mm of wear if it was done right but I've also seen some where shims that were too thick were installed.
 
#35 ·
Yeah, especially in a case like this where there was a ton of media / political pressure to "fix it". Done under those conditions, any fix is bound to have unforeseen side effects.
 
#36 ·
So I got the Transmission casing apart and have been inspecting gears. Can you guys take a look and see if you see anything?

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0BwQthpDMRBcVOVpfb1NQSHVPVGM

I wasn't able to post the photos here, so hopefully that link works. I feel like the 5th gear photo (it's at the end and is a little fuzzy has a lip along the gear) do I file this off so it's squared again or is that not worth it.

The comments I got when purchasing this was 5th gear occasionally grinds. When I opened it the oil inside was grey, I assume from metal. There are no visible major damage and the magnet only had fine filing and nothing substantial. I'm likely going to bring this to my friends shop who has a press and pull the gears and inspect them closer. I'd like to order parts in the next few days before I forget where everything goes back !!
 
#37 ·
For what's it's worth, gear oil makes a big differences in syncros engaging. I know MR2 people have their favorites, Shockproof. Miata guys love XT-M5-QS, made by Castrol for a Ford that had shifting problems. My Nissan trans with year old Coastal oil would grind on every shift when hot regardless of how slow I shifted. I put the magic XT-M5-QS in and it now never grinds, ever (298,000 on trans). Most shift problems are gear oil related, not syncro. You can put new syncros in and still have problems with the wrong oil.
 
#38 ·
Agree that choice of fluid is important I am using LWSP and really impressed beyond my expectation.

With that said... if you've done any searching you find that fifth gear syncro failure is a common problem. I had to deal with it on my car. There's a useful recent thread here: http://www.mr2oc.com/61-3sgte-turbo/648954-1993-mr2-e153-w-lsd-synchro-information.html and many other older threads.

Depending on the date of production of your trans you will look up parts on one of these two diagrams:

1993 TOYOTA MR2 COUPE 2000CC 16-VALVE DOHC EFI TURBO, MANUAL, 5-SPEED TRANSMISSION GEAR (MTM)

1993 TOYOTA MR2 COUPE 2000CC 16-VALVE DOHC EFI TURBO, MANUAL, 5-SPEED TRANSMISSION GEAR (MTM)

It's possible to buy some of the specific syncro sets as a complete assembly or you can buy the individual rings and clips/keys individually and reassemble. I've posted some details on this elsewhere if you are interested and others have too.

With the gears you've shown in the pics I would replace. Price new is steep but someone could probably pull them from a discard for you.
 
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