Perfect example of why I will never trust a load bearing dyno - MR2 Owners Club Message Board
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
post #1 of 39 (permalink) Old May 30th, 2013, 18:48 Thread Starter
Don't mess with Texas
 
Texas_Ace's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 19,880
OldTrader Rating: (31)
Perfect example of why I will never trust a load bearing dyno

This is a great example of why I don't trust load bearing dynos. They can be manipulated way to easy and even by mistake with a few simple key strokes.

An inertia on the other hand (such as a dynojet) has NO user adjustable settings that can be tweaked to screw with the numbers. So the number it reads is the number you get.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sDwjfZvmPHg
Texas_Ace is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 39 (permalink) Old May 30th, 2013, 20:49
Two Much
click here to visit the sponsor page
 
mister3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: in your bushes
Age: 47
Posts: 20,018
OldTrader Rating: (379)
for a min there i thought you were referring to this video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-pDdVsmLsvM

PLEASE LEARN TO READ

PLEASE DO NOT PM ME. IT IS JUST AS EASY TO EMAIL ME DIRECTLY AS IT IS TO SEND A PM
mister3 is offline  
post #3 of 39 (permalink) Old May 30th, 2013, 20:56
NEW PARTS - MR2Heaven.com
 
OMGMR2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: San Francisco
Age: 27
Posts: 4,522
OldTrader Rating: (126)
Garage
how about this one lol

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a12vOgambSI

  • NEW OEM & AFTERMARKET PARTS -
    To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
    (NEW ONE-STOP-MR2 SHOP)
  • THOUSANDS OF USED OEM & AFTERMARKET PARTS, ask if you need parts -
    To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Located in San Francisco & Santa Clara.
Local deliveries along CA and nearby states - I also ship worldwide
PLEASE EMAIL for any inquires, i do not check or reply to PMs/threads often, Email:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
OMGMR2 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #4 of 39 (permalink) Old May 30th, 2013, 22:01
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 428
OldTrader Rating: (2)
What are you talking about TA, 660 hp in a Nissan Sentra is nothing to <ha ha> laugh at!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Texas_Ace
This is a great example of why I don't trust load bearing dynos. They can be manipulated way to easy and even by mistake with a few simple key strokes.

An inertia on the other hand (such as a dynojet) has NO user adjustable settings that can be tweaked to screw with the numbers. So the number it reads is the number you get.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sDwjfZvmPHg
james_98188 is offline  
post #5 of 39 (permalink) Old May 31st, 2013, 06:11
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Southie!
Age: 53
Posts: 3,185
OldTrader Rating: (19)
You should see my Top Fuel Yugo.
Smurfcrusher is offline  
post #6 of 39 (permalink) Old May 31st, 2013, 07:11 Thread Starter
Don't mess with Texas
 
Texas_Ace's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 19,880
OldTrader Rating: (31)
Quote:
Originally Posted by mister3
for a min there i thought you were referring to this video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-pDdVsmLsvM
yeah that video was scary, worst dyno mishap I have seen I think. Good thing that drum didn't hit anybody, that could have done some real damage.
Texas_Ace is offline  
post #7 of 39 (permalink) Old May 31st, 2013, 09:02
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Leavenworth, KS
Age: 31
Posts: 97
OldTrader Rating: (1)
Those crazy guys they made that sentra awd too.
Xx3sgtexX is offline  
post #8 of 39 (permalink) Old May 31st, 2013, 17:30
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: NYC
Age: 30
Posts: 4,646
OldTrader Rating: (66)
I could care less what the dyno tells me I made. I'm looking for changes and I'm looking for a dyno that can keep my motor rock solid at a set RPM/Speed so I can make my adjustments. Its a tool not a show off machine.
WaltClassic is offline  
post #9 of 39 (permalink) Old May 31st, 2013, 18:11
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Round Rock, Texas
Age: 36
Posts: 3,923
OldTrader Rating: (18)
Quote:
Originally Posted by WaltClassic
I could care less what the dyno tells me I made. I'm looking for changes and I'm looking for a dyno that can keep my motor rock solid at a set RPM/Speed so I can make my adjustments. Its a tool not a show off machine.

Truth!!!
Fool83 is offline  
post #10 of 39 (permalink) Old May 31st, 2013, 23:11
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 613
OldTrader Rating: (2)
Quote:
Originally Posted by WaltClassic
I could care less what the dyno tells me I made. I'm looking for changes and I'm looking for a dyno that can keep my motor rock solid at a set RPM/Speed so I can make my adjustments. Its a tool not a show off machine.
Not if you want to be a dyno queen.
I<3mr2 is offline  
post #11 of 39 (permalink) Old June 15th, 2013, 12:03
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Age: 41
Posts: 3,331
OldTrader Rating: (2)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Texas_Ace
This is a great example of why I don't trust load bearing dynos. They can be manipulated way to easy and even by mistake with a few simple key strokes.

An inertia on the other hand (such as a dynojet) has NO user adjustable settings that can be tweaked to screw with the numbers. So the number it reads is the number you get.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sDwjfZvmPHg

This is kind of irrelevant as those are calibration settings that SHOULD be there incase they need to be adjusted. The actual power output on a load bearing dyno doesn't matter, its the ability to put the engine under load and keep it there to find Maximum Brake Torque of the engine. An inertia dyno can't really do this.

Once you have your car tuned on a load dyno, you can go to a local dynojet dyno day, and for 50bucks find out what horse power you can brag to your friends about.

Both dynos are useful depending on what you are looking to do.
lagos is offline  
post #12 of 39 (permalink) Old June 15th, 2013, 12:22 Thread Starter
Don't mess with Texas
 
Texas_Ace's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 19,880
OldTrader Rating: (31)
Quote:
Originally Posted by lagos
This is kind of irrelevant as those are calibration settings that SHOULD be there incase they need to be adjusted. The actual power output on a load bearing dyno doesn't matter, its the ability to put the engine under load and keep it there to find Maximum Brake Torque of the engine. An inertia dyno can't really do this.

Once you have your car tuned on a load dyno, you can go to a local dynojet dyno day, and for 50bucks find out what horse power you can brag to your friends about.

Both dynos are useful depending on what you are looking to do.
I never said that load bearing dynos don't work for tuning. I have said many times that I will take a loaded dyno to tune my car all day.

What I said is the numbers are completely untrustworthy which I 100% stand behind. Loaded dynos are not comparable to anything else or even really themselves in many cases.

We get people all the time that try to pass off loaded dynos as comparable to dynojets, This simply proves what I have said all along, not even close.
Texas_Ace is offline  
post #13 of 39 (permalink) Old June 22nd, 2013, 14:37
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Modesto, CA
Age: 29
Posts: 1,533
OldTrader Rating: (49)
You know why they call them Mustang dynos...? They like to come up with bs numbers.

(had to fit this in somewhere)

Last edited by L0s7; June 22nd, 2013 at 14:40.
L0s7 is offline  
post #14 of 39 (permalink) Old July 24th, 2013, 12:12
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Evansville, IN
Age: 38
Posts: 2,195
OldTrader Rating: (3)
Every played with the weather station on a dynojet...

Dyno numbers can always be argued. It's a tool.

The evidence I want is trap speed in the 1/4 and what the car weighed in at. It's a great BS filter.
Hardrvin is offline  
post #15 of 39 (permalink) Old July 24th, 2013, 12:14 Thread Starter
Don't mess with Texas
 
Texas_Ace's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 19,880
OldTrader Rating: (31)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hardrvin
Every played with the weather station on a dynojet...

Dyno numbers can always be argued. It's a tool.

The evidence I want is trap speed in the 1/4 and what the car weighed in at. It's a great BS filter.
The atmospheric conditions on the dynojet ONLY effect the corrected numbers, they are also easily seen and understood to find any cheated numbers.

Uncorrected numbers can't be fudged with user adjustable settings. Thats what is important.

I do agree though that a 1/4 mile timeslip is a very good/better tool to see how fast the car is in the real world. It has it's own issues though, namely driver skill level.
Texas_Ace is offline  
post #16 of 39 (permalink) Old July 28th, 2013, 05:31
Registered User
 
the bee guy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Age: 34
Posts: 527
OldTrader Rating: (17)
mmm, good to know... And DAMNIT, 5 minutes of dyno video turned into me watching hot girls in 1000+hp cars on youtube for 2 hours.

Last edited by the bee guy; July 28th, 2013 at 05:35.
the bee guy is offline  
post #17 of 39 (permalink) Old July 29th, 2013, 15:36
I aint afraid of no boost
 
NoShoes's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Va Beach, VA
Age: 44
Posts: 4,550
OldTrader Rating: (12)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Texas_Ace
Uncorrected numbers can't be fudged with user adjustable settings. Thats what is important.
This is why I only use uncorrected numbers on a dynojet when publishing results for the community.

The only people that constantly defend load bearing dynos are people that have a financial investment in one, or have very little experience in tuning. A good tuner will make sure your car drives as well as a factory car with plenty of power and doesn't blow up no matter the dyno available.

As far as load bearing dynos being superior to an inertial dyno for wide open throttle tuning, I'm going to have to laugh at that.

For load based tuning for off boost driveability, the load bearing dyno will only cost you money for what the street offers for free, with the small exception of tuning timing in part throttle scenarios for maximum torque via the readout from the load bearing dyno.

You're going to have to "check your work" on the street no matter what, and I have found that most people paying for tuning or dyno time have very little money to spare for an extra 3-5 ftlbs of torque at 2500 rpm at 10 inches of vacuum.
NoShoes is offline  
post #18 of 39 (permalink) Old July 29th, 2013, 15:53 Thread Starter
Don't mess with Texas
 
Texas_Ace's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 19,880
OldTrader Rating: (31)
Pretty much my thoughts^. My earlier comments about tuning on a load bearing dyno were more about partial throttle situations, in these cases the load bearing dyno IS superior. Like you said the catch is it costs more then the street.

It also allows you to do load holds at various RPM's that you could not do on the street/inertia dyno as well which can be important for race cars or cars that will be doing things like standing miles ect.

Otherwise any dyno will work fine for tuning.

1993 MR2 turbo build TBD....
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


I am still alive, just busy with life. Still got the MR2 sitting the in driveway. Someday it will be back on the road. When that will be only God knows. It will be really fast when it is though.
Texas_Ace is offline  
post #19 of 39 (permalink) Old July 29th, 2013, 16:44
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: NYC
Age: 30
Posts: 4,646
OldTrader Rating: (66)
Quote:
Originally Posted by NoShoes
This is why I only use uncorrected numbers on a dynojet when publishing results for the community.

The only people that constantly defend load bearing dynos are people that have a financial investment in one, or have very little experience in tuning. A good tuner will make sure your car drives as well as a factory car with plenty of power and doesn't blow up no matter the dyno available.

As far as load bearing dynos being superior to an inertial dyno for wide open throttle tuning, I'm going to have to laugh at that.

For load based tuning for off boost driveability, the load bearing dyno will only cost you money for what the street offers for free, with the small exception of tuning timing in part throttle scenarios for maximum torque via the readout from the load bearing dyno.

You're going to have to "check your work" on the street no matter what, and I have found that most people paying for tuning or dyno time have very little money to spare for an extra 3-5 ftlbs of torque at 2500 rpm at 10 inches of vacuum.
I agree with what both you and texas ace have said here. I'm a big supporter of load bearing dynos evers since I taught myself how to tune. I never cared before but you appreciate being able to get to that 1, 2 or 3 cells that makes your car drive like complete ____.

In cases where you have to create a new ignition map from scratch and cannot get a base map there is no other way. Load bearing IS superior weather any of US want to agree or not. Theres a reason why factories use them and also why they cost so much.

I'll strap my car down on a Djet once its all said and done so people can stop bitching about numbers but aside from that I stick to what works for us and everyone else sticks to what works for them.
WaltClassic is offline  
post #20 of 39 (permalink) Old August 2nd, 2013, 23:46
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Evansville, IN
Age: 38
Posts: 2,195
OldTrader Rating: (3)
^ agree. Find load bearing great for dialing in transient maps as well. I can do it in 1/2 the time as compared to the street and generally catch all scenarios. Plus for cars making over 400 wheel street tuning gets a little hairy and unsafe in my opinion.
Hardrvin is offline  
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the MR2 Owners Club Message Board forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in











Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: (0 members)
 
Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome