Rally x with stiff suspension? - MR2 Owners Club Message Board
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post #1 of 23 (permalink) Old August 24th, 2010, 18:56 Thread Starter
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Rally x with stiff suspension?

Hi, I just wonder if rally-x ing my mr2 (turbo 92 jdm) with stiff suspension (unknown springs and shocks, got the car like that) would break de suspension components? And will I still have fun even with wrong tires? I have a set of hankook rs2 and another of toyo t1r (which would be better probably).

I have a civic wagon 4wd too but it's so high and soft that I would be affraid to roll over, I just use it for ice lapping and light off road.

If you know any events in Ontario or Quebec, let met know.

Thank you.

Last edited by broody; August 24th, 2010 at 19:00.
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post #2 of 23 (permalink) Old August 26th, 2010, 16:47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by broody
Hi, I just wonder if rally-x ing my mr2 (turbo 92 jdm) with stiff suspension (unknown springs and shocks, got the car like that) would break de suspension components? And will I still have fun even with wrong tires? I have a set of hankook rs2 and another of toyo t1r (which would be better probably).

I have a civic wagon 4wd too but it's so high and soft that I would be affraid to roll over, I just use it for ice lapping and light off road.

If you know any events in Ontario or Quebec, let met know.

Thank you.

Would you have fun in the MR2? Yes. Is it even close to being a competitive set up? No.

The Civic wagovan is ideal actually. We had a guy here in oregon that did quite well with his. I think your concern about rolling it over is not valid assuming the Rallycross is like what we have in Oregon. Take out the wagovan!
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post #3 of 23 (permalink) Old August 26th, 2010, 21:29 Thread Starter
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I don't want to be competitive, I just want to do a rally-x or two. I did my last autoslalom event with my mom's Honda fit (with my all season civic tires) because my mr2 was at the garage .

I'm more concerned about breaking the fairly stiff suspension on the mr2, than not being competitive. Is there a risk?

And the wagovan (1987, so the 3rd gen carbed) would be better I think (even if 75hp is a bit slow for the rally-x I want to do, which isn't so twisty), but I'm not sure about roll over. On ice and snow it's fine because the ground is flat and aven, but on gravel if there is something uneven I'd be scared to roll. The car takes a lot of roll in the tight turns. On ice, it's a blast to blast to drive and it's faster than many subies.

An if I take my civic, would all season tires perform fine or should I put my winter tires? I'll think about it, I'll try to find a place with gravel to see if it looks dangerous.

The mr2 wouldn't be competitive against the 4wd, but with the mid engine and lsd, it must be better than most 2wd still, if you drive it properly.

I think this is the place. It looks a bit dangerous actually.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W9N0Bv_ztcM

Last edited by broody; August 26th, 2010 at 21:40.
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post #4 of 23 (permalink) Old August 26th, 2010, 21:55
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Wow, that is darn near stage rally bro. Not good for your stiff MR2 at all. Yes, I think you risk breaking stiff suspension on that course. Find some used stock struts and springs to slap on the MR2 if you want to run that car (which would be a hoot for sure).

Tyre choice on wagovan, hmmmm.. It looked like packed dirt but sounded like gravel hitting the underside of the subie in the video. If packed dirt, use your snow tyres.

I still say hit that course with the wagovan, not MR2. Go out with an attitude that you are going to have fun and drive appropriately. You'll be ok.

All the best,

Charles
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post #5 of 23 (permalink) Old August 27th, 2010, 10:04 Thread Starter
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I'll go with the civic probably (or not go), it's too bad there isn't any autoslalom looking rally x in my area.
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post #6 of 23 (permalink) Old August 27th, 2010, 10:14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by broody
it's too bad there isn't any autoslalom looking rally x in my area.
Yes that's what we have here in Oregon.

You can talk to the local organizers. Keep an eye out for a nice big field or grass parking area. Maybe even volunteer to help organize an event like what you want to see.
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post #7 of 23 (permalink) Old August 28th, 2010, 11:29
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I ran this event in july with my old iceracer. (92 geo storm gsi) we where tring to kill the car but it did not work!

We ran snow tires but there was a bit of a mix up and we used the tires with out the tubes in them and ended up flatting the two front tires one run and spent the rest of the day cleaning rocks out of the bead.

We ended up twisting the chassis even more then it already was. There where 3 or 4 other cars that rolled over!

so ya it is hard on cars. I think it is a very bad idea to bring a mr2 unless it is ready for the crushers but still has something left in it.

PS I am looking to a mk1 mr2 to replace the geo for iceracing needs to be cheap and in ontario.
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post #8 of 23 (permalink) Old August 28th, 2010, 23:30 Thread Starter
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Oh yeah, I won't go there then, I'm sure that the wagovan will roll over if it happened to some cars already. Still, it looks like many recent subaru took part of the event.
Why don't just find a flat gravel parking lot and put cones?
I guess that i'll stick to auto-x during summer and ice lapping/race with the civic during winter.
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post #9 of 23 (permalink) Old September 8th, 2010, 04:26
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Why don't you just rent? You can easily podium with the help of big corporations.

Just clean it off when you're done.









Keep the mr2 off the dirt. Enjoy!
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post #10 of 23 (permalink) Old September 8th, 2010, 12:21
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Originally Posted by redmr2_man
Why don't you just rent? You can easily podium with the help of big corporations.

Just clean it off when you're done.

Keep the mr2 off the dirt. Enjoy!
If that's done at an SCCA event, it is technically against the rules to use a rental car (from companies like Hertz, Avis, Enterprise, etc.). Most of the organizers will look the other way at it though. I know we used to do that here back in the late 90's during rallycrosses, but then they added a line that the owner of the car has to sign for you to use it. Rules....Blah!!!

I've used my 85 hardtop for rallycross for the past 2 seasons. It is deifinitely a learning experience!! Having no weight up front other than the spare tire really sucks for turn in on tight corners. We pulled the front swaybar off for the last event and it made a world of difference. We are running Tokico HP shocks all the way around. They seem to be working well, but we've only run one event with them installed. The other events were all on 200,000 mile original shocks.

Snow tires are the best compromise for nearly all the surfaces that we run here in MN. We run anything from gravel parking lots to clay-based farm fields. The best winter tires we've found are the Winterforce tires that are made by Firestone I think. They have a pretty aggressive tread pattern with the treads going up further on the sidewalls than Hakka's and Blizzak's and are reasonably priced.

I started racing a 93 AWD Talon, then switched to an 86 CRX Si, then borrowed a 91 Sentra SER and then went to the MR2. By far, the MR2 has the most smiles-per-run than the other ones I've used. I haven't got it completely figured out yet, but it's getting close. Like I said, it's a huge learning curve to go from AWD front engine to FWD front engine to RWD mid-engine. Mine has 200,000 miles on it and is rusty, so it's a perfect candidate for it. The underbody is solid, just the rear quarters are rusting out.
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post #11 of 23 (permalink) Old September 8th, 2010, 13:32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matchbx
I started racing a 93 AWD Talon, then switched to an 86 CRX Si, then borrowed a 91 Sentra SER and then went to the MR2. By far, the MR2 has the most smiles-per-run than the other ones I've used. I haven't got it completely figured out yet, but it's getting close. Like I said, it's a huge learning curve to go from AWD front engine to FWD front engine to RWD mid-engine. Mine has 200,000 miles on it and is rusty, so it's a perfect candidate for it. The underbody is solid, just the rear quarters are rusting out.
If it's a rallycross car. I would say weld the diff and tow out the rear alignment a bit, like 0.10-ish to start. This will make the car utterly predictable on loose surface. Doing this was the best upgrade I ever made to my aw11 stage rally car. (I rallycrossed it a lot too.) Open diff in MR2 can make the power shift around a bit in loose surface, creating some unpredictability that you MAY have termed as, "huge learning curve". You can start with alignment but the diff is the key, at least in my opinion.

The strut upgrade you did will help a bunch too.

All the best,

Charles
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post #12 of 23 (permalink) Old September 8th, 2010, 14:30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matchbx
If that's done at an SCCA event, it is technically against the rules to use a rental car (from companies like Hertz, Avis, Enterprise, etc.). Most of the organizers will look the other way at it though. I know we used to do that here back in the late 90's during rallycrosses, but then they added a line that the owner of the car has to sign for you to use it. Rules....Blah!!!
hehe. I've never done an scca rallyx, probably because most of the scca events locally are on smooth dirt surfaces with no elevation gain. We like to get a little air over the jumps if ya know what I mean

The STOCK rwd and awd classes aren't as stacked as pro mod, so you can usually earn a podium if you're comfortable on dirt. I liked the formularallyx series, but the new guy in charge is just a raging powertrip-er.

Either way, I wouldn't toss the mk2 into it.
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post #13 of 23 (permalink) Old September 8th, 2010, 23:44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Safe Drives
If it's a rallycross car. I would say weld the diff and tow out the rear alignment a bit, like 0.10-ish to start. This will make the car utterly predictable on loose surface. Doing this was the best upgrade I ever made to my aw11 stage rally car. (I rallycrossed it a lot too.) Open diff in MR2 can make the power shift around a bit in loose surface, creating some unpredictability that you MAY have termed as, "huge learning curve". You can start with alignment but the diff is the key, at least in my opinion.

The strut upgrade you did will help a bunch too.

All the best,

Charles
I completely agree with you about the diff. Unfortunately this is still a street car so I would entertain upgrading to a limited slip. If it was a stage rally car, then I would weld it. Although, stage rally is going to be a ways off yet with the little one on the way. I might not even compete rallycross next year until everything settles down a little.

What area do you rally in? I've been working the rallys here in MN and MI for the past 10 years.

Erik D
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post #14 of 23 (permalink) Old September 13th, 2010, 15:37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matchbx
I completely agree with you about the diff. Unfortunately this is still a street car so I would entertain upgrading to a limited slip. If it was a stage rally car, then I would weld it. Although, stage rally is going to be a ways off yet with the little one on the way. I might not even compete rallycross next year until everything settles down a little.

What area do you rally in? I've been working the rallys here in MN and MI for the past 10 years.

Erik D
Erik,

Thanks for volunteering to work at stage rally events!

You take care of that little one and leave the crazy rally car driving to us big kids (that have no little ones ).

I've been rally car driver since 2002. I mainly have run events in Oregon and Washington, but have traveled To Rim of the World rally (2003 in AW11) in California and I did the Kananaskis Rally up in Canada (2002 in AW11). I have won some regional class chamionships during the last 8 seasons. I built a Impreza and started with it in 2005, at Doo Wop Rally. I sold that Impreza last year. I now have another Impreza that I will build, as well as a Volvo 242. The Volvo I hope to have out at Doo Wop Rally 2011. The Impreza will just be my caged street car. I may go up and do the Big White Rally in Canada with the Impreza someday. I always wanted to do Sno*Drift as well. I love snow rally.
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post #15 of 23 (permalink) Old September 14th, 2010, 09:00
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If you do Sno*Drift, you have to come out in the fall time to do LSPR. Ojibwe is fantastic as well (I am a little biased though since this is my home event). I've worked as banner chief, advance 1, 000, 00 (with a single stage as 0), rallymaster, start/finish control, radio marshal, spectator location captain and medical sweep (fast sweep) over the past 10 years. The only spot I haven't got to work yet is behind the wheel of a competition vehicle.

I've enjoyed working rallies and love the rally community. It is the best in all of motorsports in my opinion. Even the biggest rivalries will do anything they can to help each other continue to compete. More of a family than a community really.
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post #16 of 23 (permalink) Old September 15th, 2010, 10:50
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Originally Posted by Matchbx
If you do Sno*Drift, you have to come out in the fall time to do LSPR. Ojibwe is fantastic as well (I am a little biased though since this is my home event). I've worked as banner chief, advance 1, 000, 00 (with a single stage as 0), rallymaster, start/finish control, radio marshal, spectator location captain and medical sweep (fast sweep) over the past 10 years. The only spot I haven't got to work yet is behind the wheel of a competition vehicle.

I've enjoyed working rallies and love the rally community. It is the best in all of motorsports in my opinion. Even the biggest rivalries will do anything they can to help each other continue to compete. More of a family than a community really.
Thanks again for volunteering! I agree, rally is the best!

I'll get to some eastern / central events someday... $$$
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post #17 of 23 (permalink) Old September 15th, 2010, 12:28
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I gotta say "Thank you" to you and the other competitors as well that continue to come out and support the events with your entries (and volunteering when you can't compete) even during the lean times of the economy.

Here's a pic from an earlier event this year. Sorry about the size.


On 2 different runs I spun a 360 on the course, never hitting a cone or stopping the motion of the car! Now I know why I rallycross such a short car!!

Last edited by Matchbx; September 15th, 2010 at 12:30.
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post #18 of 23 (permalink) Old September 15th, 2010, 13:09
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Now that's a great photo! Nice job!!!
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post #19 of 23 (permalink) Old September 15th, 2010, 13:51
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The surface was 4-5" of soupy mud on top of ice!! Man was it fun!!

The other advantage of using a car with flip up headlights at either a rallycross or an autocross is you know exactly where the front corner of your car is in relation to the cones. It helps you put the front tire right next to the apex cone without hitting it. I've been training myself not to look in my rearview mirror to see if I hit any cones. It's a hard habit to break.
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post #20 of 23 (permalink) Old September 17th, 2010, 00:13 Thread Starter
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I'm glad to see some discussion here even if the events you are talking abou are far from my area.
However, I never thought about having my headlights flipped on during auto-x to see the bounds of the car better . Driving an mr2 on dirt must be a nice challenge, awd is cake.
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