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post #1 of 38 (permalink) Old March 16th, 2017, 13:03 Thread Starter
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DIY Paint Job!

This is my write-up I guess? More of a journal or something.

Anyway, I am starting to repaint my '85 in Super Red. I will be repainting the same color, but in a two stage with base and 2K clear, white primer (really makes the red pop) and some minor body work. All in my home garage.

I will post before pics pretty soon, to give you an idea of where I'm headed. But right now I have the black bumpers and side trim, spoiler and side skirt and stuff. My goal is to make most of it red like the later models of the MK1, but I will leave the eyebrows and some other things black. I have to do some minor corrections, especially on the front right fender and the front lip. Other than that I am just patching up some small little dings and a couple of holes from where I deleted the front emblem.

So far I have all the equipment ready to go, just need to make a booth in my garage. I have a quote ready for paint, so I will be picking that up soon. I will keep updates on the body work and all.

Should be a fun project! My first time painting a whole car so I am going to do my best, did a lot of research.
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post #2 of 38 (permalink) Old March 16th, 2017, 15:49
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I have painted sports cars for a living for the past few decades. be really careful with the paint fumes. you really should have a fresh air mask, as the isocyanides in the hardeners are deadly. better to use a buff or bright red primer than white. red is a transparent color and it will take more coats to cover over white. more coats = more possible problems. White is great to use under yellows. for a home use, try to get a faster drying "speed" clear. less dirt and chance of runs. A guy on ebay also sells a 2 part bright red non sanding wet on wet sealer which is a good thing to use on a very bright red car as well. Helps hold down sand scratches. I do a lot of Alfas, so red is a very popular color and I have done countless red cars.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1-5-Quart-2K...MAAOSwpDdVbG6S


Be sure wipe the car down several times with a grease and wax remover even before you start to sand it, and again before you spray anything on it. fish eyes suck.

Have fun! I still remember my first jobs that I did way back when. its very exciting to watch the glossy new paint go on a smoothed out straight body.

Last edited by andyS; March 16th, 2017 at 15:51.
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post #3 of 38 (permalink) Old March 16th, 2017, 17:45
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I've been slowly painting mine as well. I start the paint photos here:
http://www.mr2oc.com/6-mkii-90-99-na...ml#post6650305
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post #4 of 38 (permalink) Old March 16th, 2017, 23:03 Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by andyS View Post
I have painted sports cars for a living for the past few decades. be really careful with the paint fumes. you really should have a fresh air mask, as the isocyanides in the hardeners are deadly. better to use a buff or bright red primer than white. red is a transparent color and it will take more coats to cover over white. more coats = more possible problems. White is great to use under yellows. for a home use, try to get a faster drying "speed" clear. less dirt and chance of runs. A guy on ebay also sells a 2 part bright red non sanding wet on wet sealer which is a good thing to use on a very bright red car as well. Helps hold down sand scratches. I do a lot of Alfas, so red is a very popular color and I have done countless red cars.

1.5 Quart 2K Urethane Colored Primer Sealer Kit - 15 Sealer Color Options | eBay


Be sure wipe the car down several times with a grease and wax remover even before you start to sand it, and again before you spray anything on it. fish eyes suck.

Have fun! I still remember my first jobs that I did way back when. its very exciting to watch the glossy new paint go on a smoothed out straight body.
Yeah I have a proper respirator and I will be ventilating the garage very well. I will check about the primer, the guy at the paint shop said white will make it a lot brighter (like it is already), but I can double check, especially since you say a red would be a lot better. I will also look at the fast drying clear, I will be cutting it back with compound anyway to make it gloss. Thanks for the advice!
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post #5 of 38 (permalink) Old March 17th, 2017, 00:59
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sometimes the guys at the paint stores really don't do much or any actual painting. I do not know why anyone would think white was a good undercoat for red. You want white chips showing all over the front of the red car from rocks over time?

very few respirators can handler icocyanides. make sure your says it does. I had a friend end up on the concrete floor after passing out while priming his Triumph. he was wearing a respirator, but it was not able to filter out the cyanide fumes. wear gloves when handling the hardeners as well. they can leach bad stuff into you right though your skin!

Last edited by andyS; March 17th, 2017 at 01:01.
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post #6 of 38 (permalink) Old March 17th, 2017, 02:16
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I don't mean to hijack the thread but what brand of car paint do you guys recommend. I am planning to do 2 stages.
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post #7 of 38 (permalink) Old March 17th, 2017, 09:43 Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by andyS View Post
sometimes the guys at the paint stores really don't do much or any actual painting. I do not know why anyone would think white was a good undercoat for red. You want white chips showing all over the front of the red car from rocks over time?

very few respirators can handler icocyanides. make sure your says it does. I had a friend end up on the concrete floor after passing out while priming his Triumph. he was wearing a respirator, but it was not able to filter out the cyanide fumes. wear gloves when handling the hardeners as well. they can leach bad stuff into you right though your skin!
The reason he told me was because that's the way it is right now, white primer underneath. You can see it through the edges and stuff where too much compound has been used, plus on the front where rock chips are. I'll definitely get red primer or at least have it tinted. I read on some other forums that it is counter intuitive but it really makes the red pop with white sealer as long as you have a good amount of base coat. I don't mind picking up another quart or two if it'll look that much better.

But I think I might have to get another respirator, a good 3M if anything. Mine is pretty okay but I'm not sure if it filters those cyanides.
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post #8 of 38 (permalink) Old March 17th, 2017, 09:44 Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by danny4327 View Post
I've been slowly painting mine as well. I start the paint photos here:
http://www.mr2oc.com/6-mkii-90-99-na...ml#post6650305
Haha, love the MK2. I wish I could even find one around here, though they do seem a little more complex than my MK1, I'm glad I have mine
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post #9 of 38 (permalink) Old March 17th, 2017, 10:13
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Achulz,

+100000 on getting a very good respirator, one rated for filtering the isocyanides. Also, make sure to get one with eye protection - the fumes can and will be absorbed through your eyes. You've only got one pair and they're important to keep :-)

Get a full-face respirator - they are your best protection and well worth it even if they cost a bit more than the nose/mouth versions.

Good luck,
Vincent
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post #10 of 38 (permalink) Old March 17th, 2017, 10:32
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these are great to have. I use mine when also doing nasty sanding as well


Supplied fresh Air Respirator breathing vinyl painter's Hood system SAR | eBay


That red sealer I linked above is a very good product. it will improve adhesion and hold down minor flaws in the prep work. it is a very bright red color too, like a top coat color, but designed to be painted over without sanding in 30 minutes. Enzo Ferrari had them paint a bright orangy red base under the Ferrari racing red cars to get a bit more pop to the colors. Don't care what the forums say, still think white is a bad choice under red. i use it under the fly yellow though all the time.

If you really want a red that pops, use a Spies hecker base coat. they mill their ingredients way finer than any other paint company, and their reds are just amazing in their color saturation. I have been told several times that you can pick out the cars I painted at our local Italian car show because the red just looks way more intense.

My SC is painted Rosso Corsa Ferrari racing red in Spies Hecker


Last edited by andyS; March 17th, 2017 at 10:35.
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post #11 of 38 (permalink) Old March 17th, 2017, 11:09
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Haha, love the MK2. I wish I could even find one around here, though they do seem a little more complex than my MK1, I'm glad I have mine
If it wasn't still below freezing outside I would have this baby painted completely!

I used this respirator and went with a bc/cc from the brand "dimension ".
https://www.amazon.com/3M-07193-Cart...ing+respirator

Amazon prime has been very useful for me for getting supplies as I get home just after the automotive paint stores close.
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post #12 of 38 (permalink) Old March 17th, 2017, 11:39
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3M does not recommend those respirators for 2 part automotive paints

scroll down:


http://multimedia.3m.com/mws/media/4...tion-guide.pdf


they do have a cartridge for their 7000 series that can filter 2 part auto paints, it just has to be changed very often

http://www.gemplers.com/tech/s3m7000.htm

Last edited by andyS; March 17th, 2017 at 11:42.
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post #13 of 38 (permalink) Old March 17th, 2017, 12:53
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Originally Posted by andyS View Post
3M does not recommend those respirators for 2 part automotive paints

scroll down:


http://multimedia.3m.com/mws/media/4...tion-guide.pdf


they do have a cartridge for their 7000 series that can filter 2 part auto paints, it just has to be changed very often

3M 7000 and 7500 Series Cartridges, Pre-filters and Replacement Parts | GEMPLER'S
That's very interesting because the automotive paint store sells the mask I use and offered it along with my purchase of 2k Primer + hardener, base coat + reducer, and clear coat and hardener.

I also used to help at a body shop, and I believe our painted used a similar mask as well.
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post #14 of 38 (permalink) Old March 17th, 2017, 14:40
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they probably filter OK when the cartridges are newish. i would not use that type of mask if I painted a lot. I want to be around to see grand kids!


I have heard lots of bad advise from guys at that work in typical auto paint stores. They know how to mix the colors and stuff, but be careful on other advise. Used to be the people at the local one knew just about everything, but that store closed down many years ago. we have chain stores here now, and the staff turns over a lot. Sucks, because now if I have some odd issue, there is no one to talk to about it that has deep knowledge of the paint process and can diagnose anything.

Last edited by andyS; March 17th, 2017 at 14:44.
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post #15 of 38 (permalink) Old March 22nd, 2017, 11:21 Thread Starter
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So for cost reasons I'm wondering if a single stage would be a better route, using the newer urethane stuff. I am having trouble finding the differences though, I understand how they are different but people on several forums seem to prefer single stage for some reason and they say it is easy to buff and make it shine. I thought it would be the other way around.

Any reason why I shouldn't do a single stage? Would greatly speed up the process since it will be a lot less load on my wallet plus I think it would be better being a first time painter and all.
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post #16 of 38 (permalink) Old March 22nd, 2017, 11:47
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If you have white primer, you can get it tinted red so rock chips don't show. you can do spray cards to see the difference this makes. Try it both ways.

@Ashultz: Single stage should work out fine. If you're painting an car from the 80's/90's your new paint will outlive your car.

However... The purpose of clear coat is UV protection and to stop damage and failure of the bae coat. I always feel that 2 stage is better. With that said, if you're painting an car from the 80's/90's your new paint will outlive your car.

For anyone thinking of painting their car at home, I will tell you right now your air compressor won't cut it. You need CFM, not PSI and this CFM will be measured with the trigger fully depressed. The downside is orange peel and lots of it. You might be able to get away with a little of peel on a 2 stage, but the single stage will not take kindly to all that cutting and buffing--you just wont have enough material. I suggest renting a compressor from a tools store and try and plan all your painting in a few days to minimize cost.

Nvidiagefore asked about paint brands. Here's my thoughts: If you properly prep the car most brands are fine. Do not mix brands (and don't play chemist). Dont use a 3M primer then a Eastwoods top coat and Tamco clear. Stay all in the same system.


For the Hobbyist, Summit Racing makes a good brand of very forgiving paint. BUT, you wont get to mix colors, you only get to chose their pre-mixed colors. If you want custom or to match OEM, then go Tamco.

Last bit of advice: Get mixing cups, don't reduce more than 10% and follow the directions of the paint: re-coat window, top coat time, etc. This is really where most DIY'ers go wrong.

And listen AndyS. Don't skimp on the safety.

Hope that helps.
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post #17 of 38 (permalink) Old March 22nd, 2017, 12:19
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Interesting thread. I have a couple parts I'd like to paint to match my car; a wingless trunk and a front fender. I can't believe the quotes I get from paint shops to just spray these unmounted parts for me.

Assuming I can borrow the necessary equipment, what are the basic steps for parts that have factory paint and no rust/damage? Can I just clean them, sand a little to promote adhesion, then over paint? The parts are factory silver, and the desired color is the factory dark blue metallic.
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post #18 of 38 (permalink) Old March 22nd, 2017, 12:23 Thread Starter
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Interesting thread. I have a couple parts I'd like to paint to match my car; a wingless trunk and a front fender. I can't believe the quotes I get from paint shops to just spray these unmounted parts for me.

Assuming I can borrow the necessary equipment, what are the basic steps for parts that have factory paint and no rust/damage? Can I just clean them, sand a little to promote adhesion, then over paint? The parts are factory silver, and the desired color is the factory dark blue metallic.
Assuming you have no dings and don't require bodywork, you have to sand back the paint to either bare metal or the primer. Then you have to use a sealer primer and then your paint system.
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post #19 of 38 (permalink) Old March 22nd, 2017, 14:39
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Years ago there were some nice fast drying single stage paints i liked a lot. But current 50 state legal single stage paints are slower drying paints, and best for a real spray booth environment. slower dry = more dirt, more issues with sags. Current single stage paints are also high solids, and they tend to go on orange peely. they are also harder to rub out and get the gloss back. Easier to get solvent pops as well if you put a coat on too thick on a horizontal surface. i only use them on inner areas on cars anymore, and have gone to 2 stage with a clear on everything.

They are fine for fleet use, like on garbage or UPS trucks, but I do not like them for a fine finish any more especially in a home made spray booth set up.

Spraying in a hobby environment, 2 stage is better in my experience, with a fast curing clear. less orange peel, and easier to color sand and polish. You still need to know how to use spray equipment (lots of variables there--temperature, many spray gun adjustments, different heat range reducers & activators, actual spraying technique) you also can not have too much light to spray. I have over 60 super bright LED 4 foot tubes in my home made booth! you have to be able to see the paint going on the car from the gun
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post #20 of 38 (permalink) Old March 22nd, 2017, 23:37 Thread Starter
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Years ago there were some nice fast drying single stage paints i liked a lot. But current 50 state legal single stage paints are slower drying paints, and best for a real spray booth environment. slower dry = more dirt, more issues with sags. Current single stage paints are also high solids, and they tend to go on orange peely. they are also harder to rub out and get the gloss back. Easier to get solvent pops as well if you put a coat on too thick on a horizontal surface. i only use them on inner areas on cars anymore, and have gone to 2 stage with a clear on everything.

They are fine for fleet use, like on garbage or UPS trucks, but I do not like them for a fine finish any more especially in a home made spray booth set up.

Spraying in a hobby environment, 2 stage is better in my experience, with a fast curing clear. less orange peel, and easier to color sand and polish. You still need to know how to use spray equipment (lots of variables there--temperature, many spray gun adjustments, different heat range reducers & activators, actual spraying technique) you also can not have too much light to spray. I have over 60 super bright LED 4 foot tubes in my home made booth! you have to be able to see the paint going on the car from the gun
So the extra couple hundred for a two stage job is worth the benefits?
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